GTA
General Discussion To Gateway To Airguns => Hunting Gate => : shadow June 20, 2010, 06:40:16 AM
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I had to start a new post since I and several other members here have and do hunt Deer with a bow and I don't believe it to be inhumane to hunt with one. Though they may run at times with even a well placed shot their still dead on their feet. My ancestors on my Mothers side successfully hunted with bow's for many moons and my Cherokee relatives would beg to differ about how deadly a bow can be. I also hunt with air pistols and believe they do have a place in the hunting field. The air pistol has it's limit's with the size of the game, distance and the shooter's ability but in the right hands can be deadly. Air pistols can be and some are as powerful as some air rifles and again the hunter must make the choice and ask themselves will this pistol drop the game cleanly, is the game within a good killing range and does their skill match the pistols ability to do the job. I wouldn't hunt Bandit's with a air pistol but have taken feather, rabbit and G-hog's with them, I know the pistols limit's. I also believe that one can hunt Bandit's with a .177 the .177 the will do the job and and like you mentioned not some low powered shooter meant to pop feather with. I know members have post some Squirrels with with belly shot's but I don't frown on them they've always followed up with a kill shot or the animal expired quickly despite the belly shot. I think of myself as a Hunter with a Heart and have no respect for the "Kill for a thrill" hunters and I try to give back to Mother Nature as much as I take. One can be a Good Will Hunter but miss the big picture when their out in the forest, everything is connected man and nature. A Good Will Hunter takes the time to guide the new hunter in the right direction, not condemn them for a bad shot. I newbie to hunting learns from their mistakes with and a good guide can lead them to the right hunting trail so to speak and once you open the eyes of a newbie to hunting with morals they will carry it forever and pass it on. I know that there are some out there that will never find this Hunt Zen as I call it despite any guidance and I'm saddened by the thought but we can still help the ones who seek it. Speaking of connections with Mother Nature and I was going to start a new post but what the heck. I had gone out for another night patrol pest control hunt last night and for the last several night's it's been slow but all changed last night or should I say this morning. :) I planned on a all nighter hunt and then move up to my other hide at the edge of the grassy field to hunt G-hog's. The night hunt was a bust but still had a peaceful night in the wood's so around 7:00am I'm packing gun and gear to relocate to my other hide when I hear an unmistakable sound. If anyone who's spent anytime in the wood's at night knows the sound of a Raccoon chattering. :o I suddenly went into stealth mode and pulled the 1250.22 out of it's soft case then began to scan all around me for the Bandit and then she appeared. I didn't raise the 1250.22 but put the safety on and laid it on my soft case then pulled the digital camera out. You see there was no need to be a hunter now but to just be a part of the Wonders of Mother Nature. She came in right at me just a chattering as if I was Momma or a long lost friend hehe so I started shooting, shooting pic's. This little lady came right up to me then began to check out all my gear climbing all over it. She checked out my milk crate that I stow some of my gear in then checked out my camo stool, shooter then me hehe. I just kept shooting pic's as she climbed a tree to get a better look at me then back down and up on my knee as I kneeled down to greet her. There was no fear between us as I let her sniff me out to let her know that I meant no harm to her. I continued to get my gear together as she climbed over it then I started to move down the trail, she was right on my heel's like a puppy I would stop and then she would looking up at me chattering hehe. I decided to see if I could get her back to some critter den's that I know the Bandit's and Country Rat's use she need to get inside since I noticed some Hawks cruising above and she's just to young and small to defend herself. I put the gear down then turned around and headed back into the wood's to guide her to some den's. She followed along chattering so I would stop and give her a chance to catch up then continue down the trail. I made it deep into the wood's and to the first set of den's she came up to me got up on my knee and chattered some more I gave her a scratch behind the ear then told her to get into the den. She climbed down and went to sniff out the den holes she found one to her liking and with a look back at me she chattered once more and climbed into the safety of the den. I hung around for another 20 minutes to make sure she didn't get kicked out from a occupied one and satisfied that she was tucked in I headed back down the trail. It was a moving experience for me but it's a experience every time that I go into the wood's. As I mentioned before everything is connected and nature knows your heart, give and take and today was a day to give. :) Each of us must find our Hunting Zen and also our hunting morals and there are many path's out there I hope each of you find the path that eases your spirit and gives you the gift of not only a successful hunt but show's you the beauty and wonder of Mother Nature. Ed
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cool
nice shooting
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Ed, great information about hunting and the proper use of airguns. I wish everyone shared your views.
I'm amazed at how tame that racoon was, I think she likes you.
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She was just like a pup but I didn't want her to get to friendly or spend to much time with her, not all humans are critter friendly. :0 'm thinking that she strayed away from the den and maybe mom so I just spent a little time with her and got her back to the critter housing. We want to keep her wild since she'll probably end up in trouble in the future, raiding cans and such hehe. Ed
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I 'm thinking your orphaned that little one Ed :) You 've shot a lot of coons lately so it's a good chance one or two of them had little ones back in the den because it's Spring time/almost summer. So she came up to you and said "you owe me".. help me please! hehehe. That was a good deed you did. I could not shoot a young coon, only young G-hogs.
I agree with your response to "Good Will.." but I did not have time yesterday to type all that out. I probably would have typed another 2 pages on top of what your wrote, but we 've been over these ideologies and moralities before, and what 's a good airgun to use or not in certain situations with different critters.
Today's air pistols can certainly not only take feather but fur too if the distance is right and we have proven that over & over in this forum and others. Medium sized critters can also be taken and have been taken with .177's air rifles. A .177 pellet to the brain is not much different than a .22 to the same spot. I took most of the Groundhogs in the summer of '08 with a Diana 36 .177 (13.5 - 14pfe gun). A couple of them weighed 13-14lbs with the rest of the adults averaged 8-10lbs, with the exception of some younger ones. All died quickly with a single shot. It's all about shot placement. A .177 can go through skull bone and brain matter just as well as a .22 and in some cases better depending on the power, because .177 usually has a higher velocity, definitely a smaller sufrace area. It has been proven that a .22 pellet needs a couple more FPE to penetrate as well as a .177 because .22 has a larger surface area, thus more resistance.
I prefer to use .22 caliber on most critters and especially coon and possum and .25 on fox, but that is my personal preference. It doesn't mean smaller caliber won't work if you put it where it counts. We had someone here take a Coyote at close range with a Diana 34 Panther .177, and Timmy took a couple of foxes with his Panther .177 before using the Disco. A head shot is a head shot.. as long as you are confident you can make the shot, and know your rifle and how it groups. I have shot Groundhogs in the head with all 3 calibers .177, .22 and .25. and have not seen a difference between the 3 calibers in how fast the critters die after being shot in the head. I have taken coon and possum with .22 and .25cal. Again no difference. As long as you have enough FT-LB's (fpe) to do the job, and the distance is right, .177 is fine for head shots on most furry critters. I usually try to limit myself to 25yds when I use .177 on fur because I know the energy drops below 10fpe past that, so that is the limit I have set for myself for fur (not feather).
There is also nothing wrong with hunting with a bow and arrow.
Ed, I think the person that posted this does not hang out in this forum regularly. Most of the pics posted here of "fur" are head shots and I hardly remember a belly shot. I made a couple of spine shots on squirrels when I used to shoot the 350 .22 off-hand without a scope, but that was almost 3yrs ago and our Poster was not around then, but regardless of that, they expired very quickly. I guess it would be ok to bring these subjects up every 6-12mos. Just because we have discussed them several times in the past few years, it does not mean others don't want to read about it or post their comments.
PS.
So seriously, did you end up taking the little coon home like the rabbit? Whatever happened to the baby bunny that eventually grew up? Did it taste good? :D
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Yup i may have taken momma out bro but this one was off the milk. The cubs usually hang with mom for about four months (16) week's and after that she'll take them out and they must find their own food. They will hang around the mother's den sometimes up to a year just because it's been their home for so long but will then move on a claim their own den and territory. I will keep my eyes peeled at night for the little lady when night hunting, probably give me away when she show's the others where my hide is at lol. The Rabbit ol "BOOT'S' was getting big and I took him up north to a friends cabin and property and released him, miles of wood's to roam in and I didn't want to take him out by mistake on a hunt hehe. Ed
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Great pictures Ed! Your a real sportsman! and a great write up!
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Thanks Dave and if the little one show's up tonight I'll have to bag the hunt and go into nurse made mode lol or worse yet bring the whole family back, can't load quick enough to take one a bunch of big Bandit's hehe. Ed
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Ed, I only had one response when i saw those pics, Aaawwwww. As far as our friends post. I don't know of any hunter who likes to see an animal suffer. Just like everyone here, I am sure we have all had or misplaced shots. This always results in a slight delay in the death of the critter but any hunter has a heart and will quickly dispatch their prey with a quick follow up shot. Many new hunters have to learn the art of hunting and not just shooting. I think a good hunter is the person who will hunt for food and sport but always have a feeling in their heart for the animal they just dispatched, even those pesky grackles. All life is sacred and should be honored. Anyone who just shoots to watch something bleed and die is nothing but a cold blooded killer and has no right to a weapon of any kind. Anyone can be a killer, but not everyone can be a hunter.
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Thanks.
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:) ..........Ed
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wow! that sure is a sight! its amazing how "tame" wild animals can be
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Yup they can be friendly and she was to young to fear man yet but still are wild and that's part of the wonder of them and the respect that I give them. :) Ed