Diopter confusion!

[daved]

Can someone tell me the difference, if any, between the Daisy Avanti, Crosman, and Air Arms diopter sights?  In looking at them on the various web sites, they all look the same and are priced about the same, but I've heard there IS difference.  I had an Avanti at one time and wasn't that impressed with it, but maybe it was just a bad one.  Thinking about ordering a set for my S200, but don't want to spend $400 either.  Any help here would be much appreciated.  I'd also like to know the thread size on the Gehmann irises, the Chinese diopter I'm currently using has a threaded iris, I just drilled the aperture out to 1/16", made a BIG difference.  But I'm thinking maybe an adjustable iris?  Later.

Dave

[Mick]

Not sure about current units on market but basically they used to come from two sources ... the Air Arms units used to be made by Gamo, whereas the remainder are of Chinese manufacture.   Now depending on when the Chinese sights were made, you will find at least two "levels of quality" .   The earliest ones, a knock-off copy of the AirARms/Gamo units originally supplied on the DAisy Avanti Valiant rifles, were pretty crude and had terrific backlash problems in both the Elevation and Windage screws ...  typically 10~15 clicks before the aperture would move.   Then about 2-3 years ago they were re-tooled and the backlash and slide slpp reduced to a more manageable level of 3-4 clicks.   My own original Air Arms/Daisy Valiant sight was good at about 2-3 clicks backlash.   I suspect that anybody in Sporter competition who is at all serious will be switching over to the newer US-made Air Foirce sights from the Edge rifle.

Mick

[ac12basis]

They LOOK alike.  But that does not mean the inside is the the same.

The "made in" county was the guidance that I got; get the made in SPAIN, avoid the made in CHINA.
This was because of the excessive slop in in the mechanism.
This was likely before the retool that Mick mentioned.

I email Pyramid to find out what the "made in" country was on the Crossman.
They said "made in Spain" ... so is likely made by Gamo (unless there is another mfg in Spain)...so I got it.

I suggest you do that for any one that you are interested in.

re the adjustable iris.  It would be used to adjust for range lighting.  Funny thing is after using mine and experimenting with different sizes, I ended up at the same iris size as the standard iris that came with my rifle.

[daved]

Yeah, when and if the Edge rifle ever makes it to market!  Thanks, Mick, that 's the kind of info I was looking for.  So do you think it would be a safe assumption that the Air Arms set is made in Spain, and everything else is Chinese?  I have a Chinese diopter at the moment, not bad, but like you said, quite a bit of slop, I'd say 5-10 clicks.  Looks like what I'm doing is turning my AA S200 into an Avanti Valiant, turns out that with the right sights on it, this is a sweet little match rifle.  Not that that should come as any surprise, that IS what it started as :-).  But more on that in another post.  

So do you know anything about the diopters from the German rifles?  I was THAT close to buying a diopter from a Walther LGR, but decided I should use the money to pay bills, instead :-(.  Are they a step up in quality, or is it just a variation on a theme?  Later.

Dave

[daved]

Just out of curiosity, how big was that standard iris?  I don't know how big mine WAS, but a 1/16" drill bit was the smallest I had, and it was probably twice as big as stock.  As I understand it, optimum size is based on available light, a very bright venue would need a smaller aperture, while a darker one, like my shop, would need a larger aperture.  Turns out 1/1/6" is perfect for my shop :-).  Later.

Dave

[ac12basis]

Dave
re: iris size
I can't find any markings on the iris, but I "think" it is 1.3 or 1.5mm.
My Gehmann adjustable is currently set at 1.3.

You are correct about the iris size vs lighting.
I shoot in my crawl space with very limited lighting.  I can't remember but " I THINK" I have a 60w bulb (don't know if it is a std bulb or a reflector bulb) in a clamp on reflector about 2 or 3 ft from the target.  Sorry about the lack of details, I would have to crawl in the dirt to go down range, so I don't go down range unless I really have to.  I also have a few 15w flourescent tubes behind me, so I'm not trying to load in the dark.

re: fit/thread.  
My Gehmann adjustable fits/threads into the Gamo, so the Gamo will take the adjustable European iris.  But oddly, my FWB standard iris got tight after a couple turns, and I wasn't going to try to force it in.  Try posting the question on the YOUTH section on the TargetTalk.org forum.  There are a bunch of coaches there, and one of them "might" know if the Chinese rear sight eyepiece thread is European standard.  

If you are still interested in adjustable iris, I recommend you look for used ones, like I did.  New adjustable iris go from expensive to VERY expensive.  

re:  the Air Arms sights.  
From what I read, they are made in the US, and the adjustments are very tight.  The reviewer was able to make the classic box; shoot, adjust X up (I forget the number of clicks he did), shoot, adjust X left, shoot, adjust X down, shoot, adjust X right shoot, and he was back on the original group.  A sloppy adjustment mechanism could not do that.

[ac12basis]

Dave
At 1/16", you are just under 1.6mm (1.59mm), so you are a bit bigger than the standard iris.
But if it works for you, use it.